Mass Murders: Is Marijuana a Cause or Just Correlated?

  Correlation or Causation?


Pot smokers like to say “correlation does not mean causation.” They are mostly incapable of objectivity, but in their idle moments, perhaps they can explain the correlation between marijuana use and the on-going mass murders caused by those whose brains appear to have been maligned by marijuana. The following are 12 examples of marijuana murders written by Roger Morgan that illustrate our point.

1. On January 2014 Darion Aguilar killed 2 and then himself in the Mall in Columbia, Maryland.

2. In the April 2013 Boston Marathon bombing, both Tsarnaev brothers were heavy marijuana users.

3. The July 2012 Aurora, Colorado theater shooter, James Holmes, was reported by the NY Post and UK Telegraph to be a marijuana user.

4. Oscar Ramiro Ortega-Hernandez who shot at the White House in November 2011, not only had a semiautomatic rifle when he went to the White House, he also had a case. “A document in the case says that he was determined to express ‘anger towards the government regarding the continued criminalization of marijuana.’ He claimed marijuana ‘made people smart,’ the document said.” The New York Times referred to Ortega as “the lazy kid who used to smoke too much dope.”

5. Tucson massacre Jared Loughner was known to smoke marijuana (it kept him from being able to join the Army) – the January 2011 Tuscon shooting is where Rep. Gabrielle Giffords was shot. 6 dead, 13 injured during the melee. 

6. On April 17, 2014, Richard Kirk, Colorado father of 3 shot his wife in the head while she was talking to the 911 operator, after eating marijuana laced candy.

7. At the Clackamas Town Center December 2012, killed 2 seriously injured 1 and then killed himself after being confronted by an armed civilian. The shooter was a chronic marijuana user starting shooting in Oregon in smoking with his mom at age 16– a toxicology report showed that he had been smoking marijuana just before the shooting. 

8. Robert Dear, shot and killed three people at Planned Parenthood in Colorado Springs. He moved to Colorado from North Carolina for easier access to marijuana.  

9. Eddie Lee Routh who killed Chris Kyle, the American Sniper, and Chad Littlefield, was self medicating with marijuana for PTSD. After smoking pot all morning with his uncle, he killed both men who were trying to help him. 

10. Ibraham Abdeslam, 31 years old, brother of Paris Terrorist attack mastermind Salah Abdeslam, was a “jobless layabout whose favorite activity was smoking weed,” according to his ex-wife.

11.John Patrick Bedell, 26 year old heavy pot smoker, college graduate from California drove cross country to Pentagon and shot three security guards before they killed him in 2010.

12. Cherif Kouachi – Paris shooter was involved in massacre of  12 people, beginning at the Paris Office of satirical magazine Charlie Hedbo. He was a pot smoking delivery boy.

Add to that the driving deaths, suicides, robberies, murders and children who die owing to neglect by stoned parents, and it doesn’t paint a promising picture for marijuana as a safe drug.

87 thoughts on “Mass Murders: Is Marijuana a Cause or Just Correlated?”

  1. Excellent article and the million dollar question!

    The correlation appears to be there, but it would be much nicer if there were serious investigation within the scientific community so we can have sound statistics rather than merely ‘informed speculation.’

    Despite all the big red arrows (from existing scientific literature) are pointing at marijuana as the mind changing culprit, establishing actual causation, via rigorous scientific method, may prove an ever elusive task. Not impossible, but a long, road with a lot of resistance considering we don’t have the political will or interest.

    However, the good news is that we can state confidently that at least drugs, specifically marijuana, can ‘enable’ mood and behavioral modification in some susceptible individuals while lowering the inhibitory threshold to become violent. So we must refrain from stating marijuana ’caused’ the derangement of the 911 attackers, for instance, but we can at least say their marijuana abuse likely ‘enabled’ their mindset to be warped and deranged enough they felt an act of terror, as revenge on the West, would bring them solace as martyrs in the eyes of Allah. Rather than seeking more marijuana to satisfy the brain’s need to maintain normal chemical balance, an act of terror was ‘learned’, which supplanted the effects of marijuana, and basically served as their new mental euphoria.

    PS Throw thousands of more names (McVeigh, Rudolf, Roeder, Jared Miller, ….) to your list above. It’s stunning.

  2. Regarding suicide terrorist attacks, the standard assumption seems to be that the perpetrators or so animated, so devout or so carried away with their beliefs, that dying is well worth the cause. And many think they will be rewarded in the hereafter.

    However, I suggest we re-think and analyze that notion. For one, many terrorists are non-Islamic, and they are also accepting suicide, ostensibly without any rewards (Ishmael Brinsely for one). And also, as we see, many of the Islamic terrorists, especially the lone wolfs, are very often described as not devout at all.

    So how about this explanation: We know that many of the terrorists, if not all, are abusing marijuana or hashish. And we do know drugs will downregulate the sensitivity of the neurons in the brain, known as enhanced tolerance from the drugs- basically a kind of ‘burn out’.

    Let me suggest their brains lose the ability to produce the the proper chemical balance of what’s normal. That is, their minds become completely apathetic so much so, for them there is no meaning in life. Not necessarily a requisite for suicidal/terrorist behavior, but this process perhaps describes much of this modern day phenomenon, as I see it.

    1. Evan, please write more and spread the message. Write to newspapers. We are failing to connect the
      dots in the United States.

  3. Thanks, I am trying.

    Oh, btw, I have contemplated this correlation/causation issue. If it’s all merely chance, then the odds would seem astronomical, especially considering that in many instances, pairs or groups of individuals engage in marijuana and later go on killing sprees.

    If it were just single lone wolf terrorists, then we might conclude the correlation is merely chance, you know, those one in a million occurrences. But then take one a million, and multiply it by one in a million to get the chances of two perpetrators coming together, or three and so forth,

    Take for instance the US Army (or Marines?) Third Brigade massacre in Afghanistan a few years ago. A cadre of four (among a group of others who assisted in cover up) all engaged heavily into the hashish they confiscated. Not terribly unusual as one can imagine many soldiers indulge as well.
    But their outcome was not benign, but instead they went on killing sprees on Afghan civilians, perpetrating horrible atrocities. I do suspect their brains, within the harsh conditions of a combat zone as it was, were pushed over the edge and deranged from that hashish abuse.

    1. Here is something else:

      Substance Abuse should be in the discussion of the My Lai Massacre. Here’s something from Digital History:

      “One of the most preposterous claims to come out of the My Lai investigation was put forth by United States Senator Thomas Dodd (D-Connecticut). The Senator, who chaired a Senate subcommittee dealing with juvenile delinquency, put forward his theory that it was excessive use of marijuana by the men of Task Force Barker that drove them to commit their atrocities. This claim runs contrary to the findings of the Inspector General. Most editorialists who commented on this claim denounced the Senator, who was facing a tough re-election bid, for trying to reap political rewards for the My Lai Massacre.”

  4. Wow. Thank you very much. I had looked into My Lai a while back, kind of wondering too. But I had never seen the information presented from the link you posted.

    Sgt, Robert Bales may fall into this category too. His unit was in charge of confiscating hashish in Afghanistan, so he was likely in possession. Plus his cohorts from other units were indulging, so it’s very likely in my opinion he did also. Of course, no one is going to come forth and admit their own association, lest they face charges and potential prison too. So all we can do at this point is wonder.

    Just moments ago, I found another interesting link describing My Lai:

    Once again, and this a huge problem, many are dismissing marijuana as the potential culprit because they are assuming the only adverse effects occur during intoxication, without realizing the long term, even permanent alterations of the brain.

    Though Dodd did understand this important distinction:

    “Thomas J. Dodd (D Conn.), Subcommittee chairman:

    In Vietnam, marijuana, dangerous drugs and even heroin are almost as available as candy bars. Estimates of drug abuse among Vietnam troops run as high as 80 percent, compared to 50 percent among youth in the United States. Furthermore, Vietnamese marijuana is usually more potent than that available in the United States. Because of this extra potency, there have been an increasing number of psychotic episodes, including violent criminal acts, among U.S. troops under the influence of Vietnamese marijuana, while such episodes are virtually unknown in the United States.

    A long-term user of Vietnamese marijuana may develop feelings of persecution and, under certain conditions, may retaliate “in a furious, vengeful manner.” This reaction may occur without recent use of the drug.”

    The “vengeful manner” describes so much of what may be going on universally.

    I think one very important link, if true and can be established, is whether or not John Hinckley, Jr engaged in drugs. As far as I know, no information exists suggesting that may be the case, yet Hinckley’s behavior and personality fit the mold perfectly.

    Thanks again.

  5. One of the suspects in the Brussels terror attacks has just been arrested. I found this five minutes ago. So I am thinking “Where are the drugs?” Sure enough, a Google search instantly reveals the connection, as is predictable. (Keep in mind that “drugs” almost invariably implies marijuana or hashish among others):

    Quote: “Cheffou lived in a small studio in an apartment building just 500 metres from Maelbeek metro station, De Morgen reported.
    Police cleared the building of all residents and spent five hours searching his small home, the paper said.
    A resident heard investigators say they had not found weapons or explosives but had ‘found enough’.
    Cheffou, thought to be a freelance journalist, is known to the authorities for drugs and violence, the paper claimed.

  6. Further correlation with regards to Ibraham Abdeslam:

    “”The ex-wife of Paris bomber Ibrahim Abdeslam has told how he spent his days smoking cannabis and drinking alcohol, as reports suggest the terror gang behind Friday’s murder spree may have been high on a cocktail of drugs.

    Naima said her former husband smoked “an alarming amount of joints, at least three or four a day”, never went to a mosque, and served two prison sentences for theft.

    The mastermind of the attacks, Abdelhamid Abaaoud, who was thought to be the target of raids across Paris on Wednesday, also did not attend a mosque, according to his sister Yasmina.

    Abaaoud, a Belgian national, was said to have briefly studied at an exclusive Catholic school, before either dropping out or getting expelled and drifting into a life of thievery and drugs, The Independent reported.
    ..Naima, who did not give her surname, spoke out amid fears that Abdeslam’s brother Salah Abdeslam, who is on the run, was plotting another terrorist act.

    Abdeslam, 31, blew himself up outside the Comptoir Voltaire cafe in the French capital, but no one else died in the blast.

    Needles, syringes and plastic tubes were found in the suburban hotel rooms the Islamic State fanatics stayed in before carrying out the bombing and shooting spree which left at least 129 dead and hundreds injured. Some reports suggest the needles could have been used to take heroin and liquid cocaine. It has also been said that the equipment could have been used to load suicide belts with explosives.
    ….The Daily Mail reported that increasing numbers of Islamic State killers are taking drugs before carrying out attacks and that eyewitness had described the terrorists as acting like “zombies” or the “walking dead”.

    The terrorists were said to have had a last supper of pizza and chocolate cakes.

    Niama told The Sun that she was horrified to hear of the terror attacks. She said: “It’s possible it was the hash, anything is possible”.”

  7. Hello Roger, I just saw your interview on Reason TV. What a tough interviewer! He was fair though, and just as well to be confronted with opposing views. You held your ground very well, and got to the key points. Good job!

    I’ve encountered that exact same resistance over and over again. For some reason, we are always put on the defensive, and isolated, as though we have tin hats and fear aliens. It SHOULD be up to the marijuana lobby to defend themselves as to why marijuana would not pose harm to individuals and society. The burden of proof and the skepticism should be directed at them, not us. This is all reversed.

    If it helps at all, I have some key phrases and counterpoints that I think can be effective, if I may offer?

    “Though everyone knows correlation is not causation, the link between a history of marijuana (hashish) abuse, long term or even permanent mental derangement and violent acts such as mass murder, is absolutely astonishing!”

    “Our national mindset is stuck on the naive notion that the negative effects of marijuana are only temporary, whereas now it’s becoming clearer and clearer via MRI studies, there is long term, if not permanent neural restructuring of the brain occurring. Pot use is a real gamble with the most important and delicate organ of our body. For most, especially with milder forms of marijuana currently used in America, the damages are minimal or compensated by new neural development, whereas it’s apparent that for a much smaller subset of all marijuana abusers, the consequences are not benign. These folks may have genetic or environmental susceptibility to marijuana abuse, and it’s very likely inducing or exacerbating their own psychoses.”

    “Of 20 to 50 million regular users, and just one percent are vulnerable to marijuana induced psychosis, some of whom will be violent, we have expanded the pool of potential murderers another 200,000 to 500,000! And it’s likely that with the increased potency of marijuana that continues to evolve, those numbers will be elevated even greater!”

    “There’s no free lunch with anything. At one time we thought tobacco was harmless. Science, with massive and painstaking efforts, finally proved that tobacco is linked with cancer and respiratory diseases, and is addictive. It was a long hard, fought battle for medicine. So what are we doing now? Now we are simply repeating the same tortuous path, except we are replacing tobacco with marijuana! Which will assuredly present all sorts of harms down the road, likely even worse.”

    “California, where water is precious as gold, produces 60% of the nation’s marijuana consumption. As of a few years ago, there were 125 million, known outdoor marijuana plants, as ascertained from satellite imagery. Each outdoor plant produces about a pound of marijuana. Plus, millions of more plants are hidden or grown indoors. Each plant consumes six gallons of water a day, for a life of about 5 or 6 months. A rough figure to go on is cultivation for a pound of water costs about 900 gallons of water. Since there are two growing seasons, one can easily compute California’s water consumption for marijuana cultivation to be in the hundreds of billions of gallons of water per year. It could be anywhere from 100 to 400 billion gallons. And all for a plant with ZERO nutritional value.”

    “The average IQ in California ranks around 95 plus or minus- the 47th lowest in the nation. And just a smudge ahead of Louisiana and Mississippi. Not to disparage those two other states, but California with its massive investment in education, should be doing much better. Marijuana is now scientifically shown to interfere with cognitive development in the brains of adolescents. Tests illustrated from the National Institute of Drug Abuse (NIDA) suggest that marijuana abuse can result in a loss of up to 8 full IQ points! Seriously, California can not afford to lose any more IQ points. Our future, our well-being and survival depend on bright, not dumbed down minds.”

    I will assuredly think of some more.

  8. Yikes, a typo and rephrase for the above:
    “…A rough figure to go on is cultivation for a pound of water costs about 900 gallons of water. ..”

    Should be; ” A rough figure to go on is that a pound of marijuana cultivation consumes about 900 gallons of water… ”


  9. Another: “Regarding causation, the scientifically proven link is ever so elusive. Even with alcohol and drunk driving accidents, everyone seems to agree the two are correlated. But that link is not strictly scientific since each and every drunk driving accident could theoretically be attributed to some other cause. It could simply be that the accident was bound to happen regardless.

    Fortunately most reasonable thinkers of society don’t think this way and understand that alcohol is an impairment to driving, so the drunks involved in auto accidents are correctly blamed.

    But for some reason when it comes to marijuana, few anywhere will agree that marijuana (or other drugs) abuse could conceivably induce or exacerbate psychosis, which in turn engenders a proclivity to violence. Substance abuse (including marijuana) is already scientifically linked to mood and behavior modification, while lowering the inhibitory threshold.

    Thus, we may be a long way off from ever establishing a scientifically proven link between marijuana abuse and violent crime. Yet valid research already suggests marijuana abuse may ‘enable’ the minds of some susceptible abusers to be more violent. ‘Enablement’ v.s. ‘causation’ is the key distinction.

    So rational minds clearly understand the hazards of alcohol, yet most can’t quite comprehend the link between marijuana, mental illness and violent crime.”

    Another: “A few huge obstacles, I believe, are preventing us from seeing clearly to what is happening to our country. One is we are stuck in the mode of thinking that the only harms that can result from marijuana are only while “under the influence”.

    Plus, compounding our misunderstanding is the fact that millions of past marijuana users only experienced mild forms of marijuana, never had adverse reactions, and thus erringly assume to this day that marijuana is harmless.

    Whereas the point we are trying to make is that the real harms derive not only for short term impairments while being ‘high’, but also from long term, perhaps permanent structural changes of the brain. Thus, a marijuana abuser can smoke for years while young, later decide to ‘come clean’, yet still retain a mind that is adversely altered, and in some rare cases, dangerous.

    The other monstrous hurdle and primary source of resistance we face is that many millions of users are truly addicted, or partially addicted. According NIDA, the ‘top brass’ of modern neuroscience, of the regular day to day marijuana users, and estimated 25 to 50% are truly addicted. It’s not just an optional habit; their brains tell their minds they NEED this drug and do whatever it takes to have access to more of it. The neurons of their brains are rewired favorably toward THC which gives them a new source of heightened pleasure that supplants the brain’s natural pleasure/reward system. Thus their minds will intentionally not hear or agree with anything that contradicts their new, marijuana favorable thought processes. Marijuana becomes a new source of worship.”

  10. Perhaps being a bit overly cynical, I do sense there is more than ignorance going on with society’s unwillingness to make the correlation between cannabis and terror. As pointed out earlier, it sure appears that an unusually high percentage of terrorists domestically and abroad, affiliated with Islam or not, have marijuana abuse history.

    Now one would think bright minds would be enthusiastically pursuing all potential angles, including the mindsets of the psychopaths.

    Of course, in part it’s a general lack of understanding of the established science that supports the observation that drug abuse can be associated with mental illness, and drug abuse combined with mental illness may lead to violent personalities. This is a fact, yet many people predictably are occupied with other interests, so staying current with science often being one of the least desirable pursuits. Fair enough.

    But then again, there are a lot of bright, inquisitive minds out there, whereas very few of them will even acknowledge this potential connection.

    So the most cynical side of me suggests this willful ignorance might be derived in part from widespread favoritism for marijuana. That kind of deception and hoax is obvious within the medical marijuana movement. They know it, we know it, everybody knows the primary driver is more access to marijuana for the purposes of indulgence, all in the name of medicine. Though a nugget of truth exists, especially with CBD, the whole thing otherwise is a complete lie perpetrated by addicted minds.

    So what might be going on is that information and suspicion that should be presented in a national manner to the people, is intentionally ignored because of marijuana favoritism.

    Thus for example, the fact that Mohamed Atta and his ‘students’ used marijuana, as described from a firsthand and reliable witness in Hamburg, Germany, may not be widely disseminated information because those whose minds favor marijuana do not want the public to draw conclusions. If the public becomes outraged that marijuana may have adversely affected the minds of the WTC terrorists, as well as most if not all other terrorists, national marijuana legalization would likely not see the light of day. In fact, all those who have been promoting and accepting marijuana all these years could be shamed and vilified and restricted from marijuana with stronger laws and tighter borders.

    Stretching this idea elsewhere, as I understand, Afghanistan is the world’s number one producer of hashish, the concentrate of cannabis. And if I understand correctly, much of that hashish is smuggled to Europe as well as various terrorist groups throughout the Middle East.

    Thus for the same reasons, I can’t help wondering if the marijuana abuse connection to the terrorists in Belgium this year, and twice in Paris last year, is information that is intentionally suppressed and ignored.

    Yes I know, this is very cynical speculation- a very scary and sinister thought indeed. But if true, thoroughly wicked.

  11. Oh another: Pot proponents often cite how very prominent and successful people indulged in marijuana when they were younger. It’s unquestionably true, but that observation in no way contradicts the scientific fact that cannabis abuse can inhibit cognitive development.

    For one, the luminaries that used pot may have used it less than is thought, or may have used less potent varieties, may have been more impervious to harmful effects, or possibly, as bright as they are, may not have achieved their full potential had they abstained.

    The effects of marijuana, just like alcohol, range the whole gamut, from benign to disastrous. To ignore the negative outcomes (as with addiction or psychosis or inhibited intellect) is perverted reasoning and completely disingenuous.

  12. Sometimes I want to close my eyes, cover my ears & pretend theories such as purposed by EvanB “cynical speculation” (his words) could not possibly have merit.

    But I’ve told close friends for some time I suspect widespread revenue from pot is definitely linked to revving up the economy especially in the 23 MMJ & 4 recreational states ( + the D.C. of Columbia) which incentivize the public to not connect MJ HARMS (addiction, or psychosis which often leads to horrific outcomes ). It’s not a coincidence MJ has been the #1 cash crop since ’96.

    It shouldn’t shock us why drug educ linking drug abuse to triggering MI etc is not taught in school or shouted out by the federal agencies like NIH, NIDA, NIMH… So, what theory shouldn’t be considered now?

    Just sad times when 22 “medical experts” convened by Johns Hopkins Univ and The Lancet recently called for decriminalization of all nonviolent drug use and possession claiming to cite growing evidence about the failures of the global war on drugs (3-24-16 “Top medical experts say we should decriminalize all drugs and maybe go even further” WA Post). To think these statements stem from the Commission of the Johns Hopkins School of Public Health should give society pause. The new age thinking is called “harms reduction policy” which is a way to brainwash the public into believing drug use is not the same as drug abuse. Seriously, do we really want to start condoning drug use in America as an acceptable social norm? What is going on? We must stop ignoring the negative aspects from 21st century pot.

    Wake up folks and please, please start connecting the dots.

  13. And another: John Battaglia, murdered his two young daughters.

    “…By August of 2000, after nine years of marriage, Pearle and Battaglia got divorced. But the abuse continued. Battaglia left a threatening phone message for his ex-wife — a violation of his parole. He also tested positive for marijuana — another violation….”

  14. In reference to the above post mentioning how American troops of the Stryker Brigade who were using hashish and committed acts of terror on Afghan civilians, a few excerpts:

    Quoted excerpts from internet article: “Army Staff Sgt. Calvin Gibbs has been sentenced to life in military prison with eligibility for parole in 10 years.
    A military court-martial Thursday found Gibbs guilty of murdering three Afghan civilians, illegally cutting off pieces of their corpses to keep as “souvenirs” and planting weapons to make the men appear as if they were Taliban fighters killed in legitimate firefights…………….

    Gibbs is the highest ranking of five soldiers charged with being part of a rogue “kill squad” that targeted civilians. Another seven soldiers also were charged with lesser crimes including abusing drugs, keeping “off the books” weapons and intimidating a fellow soldier not to speak out against the platoon’s alleged killings.”

    .. and to quote from another article:

    “Many of the defendants, as well as six others charged in the unit, pleaded guilty to other charges, including smoking hashish and assaulting a soldier who eventually led Army investigators to discover the killings.”

  15. Given the available science today, we know that a small percentage of those who indulge in drugs such as marijuana will develop disorders, including mood and behavioral changes, lowering inhibitions, addiction and psychosis such as schizophrenia. Some small percentage, but not all. A key distinction.

    If one hundred thousand indulge, it’s really not far fetched at all to imagine a few dozen, or hundred, or maybe over a thousand, will develop long lasting, even permanent mental disorders, especially while indulging under stressful situations as combat. They might not merely be “snapping” under the circumstances, but snapping from drug induced mental derangement.

    Now, isn’t it at least interesting that it appears the most if not all the crazy, often suicidal, Islamic terrorists ALSO engage in marijuana or hashish. Hashish is a fundamental part of the culture in some areas with some groups in the Middle East. I recommend that anybody research for themselves, and be amazed too. They even eat the stuff.

    So we must wonder if some individuals are more prone to psychological disorders from marijuana and other drug abuse, and that among this smaller subset, especially in dire, harsh and psychologically distressful situations, some of those individuals using those drugs alter their brains to such a degree of derangement that they seek vengeance on society via terrorist acts.

    If true, the more the West accepts marijuana, the more who will indulge, and the more we might ‘manufacture’ sociopaths. The question is will we ever at least address this possibility, or will we continue simply to always find other motives, whether it’s the teachings of radical Islam, anger against abortion doctors, anger against the US government, anger against cops and so-called ‘police brutality’, racism, anger against the President for not completely legalizing marijuana nationally. Or some might think the world is a Batman movie, and then shoot up a movie theatre.

    We might simply be following the downward spiral that began in the Middle East a thousand years ago. Their once great civilizations have crumbled, and it might be something as simple as a pervasive medical condition as marijuana induced mental illness. They are constantly fighting each other for any kind of reason, committing suicide bombings, assassinations, etc.- just nuts. Will this menace simply slip by us too because some love, even worship marijuana?

  16. More correlation with Brussels terrorists, “man in the hat”:

    Quote: “Abrini had been on the run since November, when Belgian police issued an international arrest warrant against him. Abrini — who was known to police for drug and theft offenses — was caught on CCTV at a gas station in the north of Paris, two days before the November 13 attacks that left 130 people dead in and around the French capital. With him was Salah Abdeslam, who was arrested on March 18 during a police raid in the Brussels suburb of Molenbeek for his role in the Paris attacks. Last week, Belgian officials approved the extradition of Abdeslam to France.”

  17. A little something I gleaned recently that might offer insight:

    From some of various other message boards, marijuana use while under the influence is said to “enhance awareness” or “heighten feelings of the moment”, or descriptions to that extent.

    This may offer a valuable cue because it may imply that while under the influence, users subjected to any kind of thought, or input from say radical ideas, or animated ideology, or passionate thoughts about anything, (abortion for instance), may be inculcating into their brains those thoughts in a very serious, deeply-seated manner. (for lack of better words here!). Or look at it as how we all have normal thoughts and feelings and ideas, etc, and then contemplate, take whatever actions we might deem appropriate. Whereas perhaps someone using marijuana (such as the 9/11 attackers, or the Paris attacker, Robert Dear, Holmes, Loughner, etc.) will ‘enhance’ multifold those thoughts, enough to a degree that a passion is severely infused into the brain to the point of psychosis.

    Furthermore, then consider how marijuana is scientifically known to alter mood and behavior, and lower inhibition. (though explaining this in words is tough!)

    Hope this makes sense?

    1. Actually, we don’t think there’s any kind of heightened awareness. There is feelings of the moment which exaggerate the feeling but don’t deepen it.
      Probably it is more in these moments that people can block out other thoughts, such as the conscience, or the arguments against it. Actually, it may
      make the thought processes more shallow. What Baudelaire said was that it created a “subjective version of reality.” So this subjectiveness
      can come from within the self — such as paranoid thoughts — or from the outside, the type of things that groups with an agenda that wants followers would impose.

  18. This is a very interesting theory. Just curious what all of you think regarding the causality of these crimes and the widespread availability of assault style weapons. Liberals would say such easy access to such weaponry is far more responsible for the carnage of mass shootings than marijuana use.

    1. We need to consider every possible causal factor. It is not either/or, but multiple reasons, marijuana being one of the strongest.

  19. I agree — its obviously the pot. Gets me so mad when liberals always blame guns. Thank you for having the courage to point out what the media tries to deny: potheads are dangerous and they should not be allowed to have guns. Especially the really crazy stoners because they almost always go for assault style so they can kill lots of people really fast. We should start drug testing people who want to buy guns. If pots found in their body? Forget it! No gun. Guns don’t kill people , potheads do.

  20. Well good for Colorado. Why only the medical users tho? If what you said about subjectiveness is true and all these killers have this in common then we cannot allow marijuana users to have guns. Their mass killings hurt all of us, including responsible gun owners.

  21. Researching one of the Charles Manson clan of the sixties, Leslie van Houten, I discover this:
    Quote: “However, during that time she began experimenting with drugs such as marijuana, hashish and LSD, which she took on a progressively more regular basis. At one point during here teens, she also ran away briefly with her boyfriend to the Haight-Ashbury neighborhood of San Francisco, a hub of the counterculture at that time.”

    I can’t help wondering there are parallels between how OBL and Manson operated.

  22. And by the way, it’s worth noting that Osama Bin Laden’s compound in Pakistan was adjacent to large fields of marijuana. Coincidence? It’s just too weird how this happens!

    Just about everywhere we see wickedness, so often we also see some kind of connection to drugs, current, prior or both. (Even that horrible wreck in California recently.) Sometimes we don’t see a connection, of course. But the correlation is nonetheless alarming and does merit national concern, which we are not getting.


    One very good argument from the pro-cannabis side is that the degenerates of society who are prone to crime will naturally gravitate to the vices, such as drug abuse. So maybe all we are seeing is a variation of this effect and reading too much into the correlation. Throw in some cherry picking and confirmation bias, and our concerns are unwarranted.

    Fair enough but there are a lot of sociopaths coming from very unlikely cultural situations. Take the Manson clan for instance, and the young, middle class women who got entranced with this cult and then went on killing sprees. (One of the women is in the news right now.)

    First, it’s very unusual for women to become mass murderers, especially young women from decent, suburban middle class families. Generally just unheard of. And if that were merely one of those one in a million chances, note that several women of similar backgrounds also got involved in the Manson cult. (and men too.)

    To me, it implies that sociopaths are not necessarily being ‘born’ that way, but instead they are being created. And very likely in my opinion, the cult of brainwashing and drug abuse made this possible.

    The women got ‘radicalized’ just like the Muslim terrorists, in a very similar manner. Perhaps some who are socially marginalized have a greater attraction to cults and subsequent vulnerability. But all indications are that drug abuse itself enabled the deranged mindset that resulted in such acts of terror. Afterall, MRI studies show how THC enters and affects the very part of the brain that regulates mood and behavior, as well has a link to schizophrenia.

    In other words, without the drugs, these evil acts might never have occurred.

  23. Another correlation: John Carlton currently in the news for alleged murder in Seattle. Plus he has a long criminal history including marijuana possession in 1997.

    Seems like too long ago to make a valid connection, but consider a couple of points. His mind may have been permanently altered in a very negative manner from back then that continues to the present. Or, this at least indicates his life involved drug abuse, which very likely continued in following years up to the present. The conviction was then, but the lifestyle stayed the same.

  24. Of course, there seems to be a consistent correlation between marijuana abuse and bomb making for terrorist purposes. (Tsarnaevs, McVeigh, Rudolf, Loughner too, Holmes?, and many others).

    Or for instance, simply research the Weathermen Underground of the radical sixties:

    Quoted from the Encyclopedia of Anti-Revisionism, article by George Tyler, 1981. ‘Weather Underground: Driving Down a Dead End Street’. (Note: that webpage states any information of theirs is public domain, free to copy and distribute):

    They “glorified the use of marijuana, LSD and other drugs – saying “dope is one of our weapons” in making revolution. After a series of arrests and government indictments against Weathermen, they decided to go underground in 1970.

    In the early 1970’s the Weather Underground did no mass political organizing. In March 1970, three Weathermen were killed while constructing a bomb in a New York City townhouse, an action which shocked many Weathermen sympathizers. In the early 1970’s Weathermen took credit for a number of terrorist bombings of police stations, government buildings and a Pentagon washroom. They also engineered the jail break of drug cultist Timothy Leary, claiming he was a political prisoner.””

    All about the world, the parallels with terrorists who abuse cannabis is amazing! Drug abuse combined with disillusionment, then bomb making. It happens over and over again. Yet our country is on the verge of marijuana legalization, and worse, acceptance, which legalization naturally engenders.

    Houston, we have a problem!

  25. Great idea and I heard the pot tests used to detect stoned drivers test positive for days or weeks after a person gets high. If that’s true we could find out who all the pot users are who want to buy guns and keep an eye on them. Of course the government would never go for it.

  26. Bry: “This is a very interesting theory. Just curious what all of you think regarding the causality of these crimes and the widespread availability of assault style weapons. Liberals would say such easy access to such weaponry is far more responsible for the carnage of mass shootings than marijuana use.”

    As far as assault rifles, it would be interesting to see statistically what role they have in mass murder, at least within the US. I may be wrong, but I suspect there role is minor.
    Personally, I do think we can restrict their availability however, and still not infringe upon our 2nd amendment rights at all. There’s got to be some limits to ‘gun rights’ and personal protection, otherwise at the logical (and absurd) extreme, a person can’t be allowed to build a nuclear bomb in their living room, for instance, for ‘home security.’

    But you are onto something profoundly pertinent, and that is are guns and their availability the problem behind American violence, or is it mental derangement correlated with prior drug abuse? For me, all the big red arrows are starting to point at drugs.

    Politically, the left gets a lot of mileage by blaming guns exclusively because they know that guns are prevalent within much of rural, conservative America. The strategy is transfer the blame to conservatism for the ideological gain within the eyes of the American public.

    Yet the shooting madness invariably revolves around drug abuse, mostly in the big cities where drugs are dealt. It’s gangs, cartels, people on drugs, people seeking drugs- a whole drug culture that can turn deadly violent from time to time. Additionally in my opinion, it is very likely that the violence derives not so much from the illegality of drugs, but from drug induced mental derangement. Nearly all, if not all, these violent criminals in the drug trade, are abusers of drugs themselves- a little known fact! And personally, I think their use of marijuana over years of abuse, has completely depleted whatever naturally empathy for life they may have once had.

    Establishing causality is one of the most elusive challenges of modern science.. There are a host of factors to consider- genetics, age, cultural environment, economic status, health, nutrition- all of which in conjunction with drug abuse can influence outcomes.

    One school of thought is that violent crime is genetically determined, so there’s not much we can do about it. I think that genetics can play a role, but it’s merely one element within the complex panoply of influential variables. Otherwise we would have to conclude that our ‘minorities’ are genetically more prone to violence (as per statistics), and there’s nothing we can do about. Not only is that racist in principle, it’s totally wrong. There are many other factors.

    But the one persistent variable among all situations, appears to be to be drug abuse! And that specific drug is marijuana. It’s amazing how it always seems to pop up where ever evil acts are performed.

    Just Google search just about any crime and marijuana. Just moments ago, for instance, I was trying to find information about something completely unrelated, but one of the first search results was about a grisly crime recently in southern California where some Middle Easterner was just apprehended I think in Iran, was being extradited back to the US. He and others robbed a medical marijuana dispensary, kidnapped the owner, (this is all ‘alleged’) took him into the Mojave desert where they tortured him.

    It’s all too weird, so uncanny. This is happening in our beloved country, founded on ‘goodness’ and care for the human plight, yet this horror continues to happen among us, and appears to be growing. It seems this evil stuff going on, somehow, some way, ALWAYS has a connection to marijuana.

    Marijuana is tricky as the devil. We can’t seem to pin it down scientifically, because for whatever science that comes about, it always seems to be ‘iffy’ and inconclusive, or even immediately refuted.

    But, if there is a ‘devil’, an agent that brings about wickedness, (picture the dying baby at the OKC bombing, for instance) in my opinion, marijuana throughout the ages, mostly unsuspected and unbeknownst to mankind, might be its incarnation.

  27. I was just looking over commentary at one of the pro-marijuana websites that was refering to the notion here on this website that Robert Dear and others were psychotic from prior marijuana abuse. Almost all the claims in their commentary at the other side dismissed the correlation as pure chance. One post stated that of some 22 to 30 million pot smokers in the US, it’s natural that a small, uncontrollable percentage would also use pot. Thus the conclusion is the general population of non-marijuana users has just as many schizophrenics.

    Another post there stated: “Cannabis flowers and their extracts do NOT produce psychosis, hate nor savagery. In general, they stimulate imagination, love and personal connections. Stand up against ALL purveyors of “marihuana” hysteria, and defend our basic human right to grow cannabis!”

    Well, at the very least, some progress towards general understanding is being made! That is the dialogue from both angles is finally acknowledging the long term affect of substance abuse, and how the brain can be affected long after even when not intoxicated. That is a milestone!

    The other bit of good news is at the controversy here is at least gathering general attention and discussion, pro or con. We are still being entirely ignored at the national level, but it appears inroads for thought and discussion are starting. Now, if only some national bigwigs, could catch on and comprehend the issue. There was plenty of outrage over the Flint, Michigan contaminated water crisis for instance. Just imagine the outrage that could possibly ensue over the likely fact that the 9/11 terrorists’ minds were adversely affected from prior marijuana abuse, as well as the minds of virtually ALL (it appears) of the other terrorist attackers.

    Now, to address the one statement above that marijuana can only “stimulate imagination, love and personal connection”.
    Need one explain that some of the most heinous, egregious crimes in the history of the world are being committed by pot heads? Tsarnaev, McVeigh, Roof, Dear, Rudolf, Bundy, Dahmer, etc.

    And of course, all the Islamic terrorist groups are laden with drugs such as hashish and marijuana. And what’s so unbelievably bizarre is that it appears that none (as in zero) of our experts in such matters even know this, let alone make a connection! Just google search any of the terror groups and see for yourself. Marijuana and hashish are a fundamental way of life, and yet we (as in the West) are almost completely clueless. It’s stunning.

    Regarding the “pure chance” explanation, I would think that statistical studies are warranted and should be very important. It’s virtually impossible to sit down and analyze every homicide or other act of violence, and research what if any connection to marijuana or other drug abuse there is. The task is overwhelming.

    However, what little we can do within a limited sampling, what we do see is shocking. The correlation does appear very strong, far beyond what we could call mere chance. But we still don’t know that for sure.

    But we do know that marijuana abuse does not necessarily render all abusers “peaceful and loving”, and we do know that THC infiltrates key areas of the brain that control mood and behavior. And we do know there is a correlation between drug abuse and psychosis.

    Imagine your kid comes home one day and says he is going off to hang out with some friends, and that they plan on playing Russian Roulette. Wow, you think, but you are informed they plan on playing with an empty gun. No one has checked, but their uncle a year ago told them the gun did have one bullet in it originally, but he thinks since then, the gun was probably fired (he could be thinking of another gun, he’s not sure), but everybody in their excitement is assuming the gun is now empty.

    Should the kids go off and play the game anyway? The gun might be empty and it might not fire, and then all is fun, happy and thrilling. But what if the general population in its acceptance is actually wrong about marijuana’s supposed harmlessness, and the gun does fire. Why is America playing this stupid game?

  28. Interestingly, today April 20 is a day of celebration for marijuana lovers. Oddly it is also the anniversary of the Columbine massacre in Colorado, the first state to legalize marijuana. The Oklahoma City bombing was on April 19 and the Boston Marathon Bombing occurred on April 15.

    Now will anybody in the national media make note of this interesting set of circumstances? And what are the chances anyone of national presence might mention the subject of drug induced mental illness as possibly being correlated to these horrors?

    And honestly, while not implying any correlation whatsoever, just merely pondering the weirdness of it all, it’s a ghastly coincidence that April 20 is also the anniversary of Adolf Hitler’s birthday.

  29. Just for verification, here is an article mentioning the bomb making equipment of Jared Loughner entitled:
    “FBI: Bomb-making cache found in Jared Lee Loughner’s home”

    And regarding James Holmes:
    “Pictures Show Bombs in Aurora Theater Shooter James Holmes’ Apartment”

    It’s important information since the standard narrative at the national level is ‘gun control’, or our ‘violent gun culture’, yet many of these sociopaths are also making bombs.

    Some day one can hope our national narrative starts to also address our “drug culture”, the potential for mental derangement and how so much violence revolves around recreational drugs.

    Is it simply that many of the sociopaths almost invariably happen to like marijuana and there is no adverse effect from abuse, or are they altering their minds in devious ways from all the mind-altering drugs they use?

    I don’t know why it’s such a difficult concept for our country to grasp and ponder. For the most part, we are in denial.

  30. Oh yes, and before this one slips away into oblivion. In 2011 there was another bombing attempt in the Denver area near Columbine High School on the very same day as that act of terror, April 20. “420” pops up again!

    Quote: “Moore’s criminal history includes dangerous drug possession, larceny, possession of burglary tools and fugitive arrest. He was also convicted in a bank robbery in West Virginia in March 2005. The indictment says he got away with about $2,500 and assaulted some employees. He had been serving an 18 year sentence at the Federal Correctional Institution in Estill, S.C. The sentence was reduced to 7 years, and under the federal system inmates can earn 57 days of good time per year.

    The timing of the bombing attempt – the incident happened on the 12th anniversary of the Columbine tragedy – has raised questions about whether a motive might be linked to the shooting rampage at Columbine High School, but so far that remains only speculation…”
    “Drugs” use almost invariably implies he engaged in marijuana too. Fortunately, this disaster was averted, and subsequently did not get abundant national attention like Columbine.

    Most claim marijuana is a ‘soft drug’, but it must affect the mind in a powerful manner. How else can we explain Colorado’s willingness to legalize marijuana right after two horrendous acts of terror (Columbine and Aurora), and this averted bombing, all perpetrated by drug abusers?

  31. And doing a bit more research for the record here, there’s reasonable evidence that the Columbine terrorists made bombs and also smoked marijuana. The bomb evidence is easily verifiable in news articles.

    One of the blogs mentions marijuana, but also claims the two never did any other drugs.

    To quote: “Rage against the dying of the light
    Random thoughts about Columbine and stuff. Ask me anything.

    Did the boys ever do drugs(weed, heroin, cocaine) do you think they would? would they become friends with someone who did it?
    Dylan confessed to having taken marijuana on his diversion questionnaire (Eric denied ever having taken drugs) and others claimed that they’d been seen smoking pot. For example, according to student Stefanie Haney’s statement (JC-001-000835):

    Stefanie said that she had talked to Dylan Klebold and Eric Harris while they were all in the “smoker’s pit.” Stefanie told me that she had smoked marijuana with Dylan Klebold and Eric Harris while they were in the “smoker’s pit.” She said this was in 1998, and said she has heard Dylan Klebold and Eric Harris talk about how they hated their parents.

    Patrick McDuffee, another student and “Trenchcoat Mafia” member, said in his statement (JC-001-010793):

    When asked about drug use, McDuffee stated Harris and Klebold smoked marijuana, but used no other substances.

    So they apparently smoked weed but didn’t do any harder drugs.”

  32. I just noticed an interesting article on this very topic:

    “Marijuana Use Causes 7-Fold Increased Risk of Violent Behavior”


    I would imagine one way to tackle this “chicken vs the egg” riddle is to observe controlled subjects. That is, observe how Manson, OBL, or Hamas operated with subjects using marijuana or hashish.
    The other ‘hint’ to an answer might be consideration of how multiple sociopaths can congregate to commit specific crimes. That is, two or more apparent sociopaths work together for evil objectives.

    For instance, often we see the ‘lone wolf’ operators which might be the one in ten thousand or the one in a million. And they use marijuana too. But imagine the odds of two sociopaths just happening to find each other, and they both also like marijuana. Or three, or four, or a dozen. (Atta and his clan, or the Third Stryker Brigade atrocities come to mind.)

    Seems to me the probabilities become astronomical for this to be mere chance. That several sociopaths would just happen to find each other, and that they all happen to like marijuana, seems highly unlikely from a ‘mathematical’ perspective.

  33. Plus, Dr. Fields (also the author mentioned in above post) has an excellent article discussing substance abuse and creativity:

    “Creativity, Madness and Drugs”

    Stunningly good, insightful article!

    Imagine the millions of Americans being lured into the wicked world of drugs, imagining that somehow they will become enlightened like the entertainment role models they often worship, and perhaps more imaginative or creative like them, but instead develop mental issues and addiction problems instead that will haunt them for the rest of their lives.

  34. More correlation regarding the recent mass shootings in Ohio. Marijuana involved? Of course!

    “PIKETON, Ohio — Investigators found marijuana growing operations at three of four crime scenes where members of a Southern Ohio family were killed execution-style, Ohio Attorney General Mike DeWine said Sunday….”

  35. Regarding the link and article “Marijuana Use Causes 7-Fold Increased Risk of Violent Behavior” posted above, it’s mentioned the findings were “bidirectional”. This means that sociopaths and the criminal element by their very nature will be attracted to the world of drugs, but it also means and corroborates the causal correlation too. That is, marijuana is indeed adversely affecting brains to a degree that violent outcomes are more prevalent than if otherwise marijuana was never used.

    And tying this to the mass murder in Ohio recently, the illegal drug trade naturally attracts the criminal element, but then again, those involved in the drug trade almost invariably are also abusing drugs (marijuana for sure) themselves.

    I bring this up because this crime, which by the way seems to have cartel connections, will be used by the pot lobby as one more example for why marijuana should be legalized. But what’s omitted in that argument is that abuse of marijuana itself, legal or not, will still engender a greater percentage of violent crime. After all, the least of the worries on the minds of criminals is whether or not the drug they are abusing is illegal or not.

    Most importantly as I see it, the criminal element and the sociopaths are murderously violent at times not because marijuana is illegal, but because their brains are adversely skewed and deranged from years of prior drug abuse.

  36. If a person wants to investigate he or she would find that a staggering number of the notorious mass murderers of years past were heavy druggies, specifically users of marijuana. Dahmer and Bundy are couple that come to mind.

    Excerpt from interviews , “Ted Bundy: Conversations with a Killer”: (Bundy, btw, was the stalker and murderer of women.)

    “I’ve never tried cocaine. I think I might have tried it once and got nothing out of it. Just snorted a little bit. And I just don’t mess with it. It’s too expensive. And I suppose if I was on the streets and had enough of it, I might get into it.

    But I’m strictly a marijuana man. All I do…. I love to smoke reefer. And I haven’t, uh, never have tried anything but reefer. And valiums. And, of course, alcohol. ….”


    As far as Jeffrey Dahmer, the cannibal, sodomist and murderer, there are many researchable excerpts, yet this one picture of him as a youth with a six foot marijuana bong made out of snow in his yard tells it all:

  37. While we’re at it, here’s one of many excerpts regarding Eric Rudolph, the “Olympic Bomber” and abortion doctor murderer:

    Partial excerpt quoted from CBS, April 1999.:
    Quote: “He’s not who you think he is, this man who allegedly bombed his way into history at the Atlanta Olympic Games, CBS News Correspondent Jim Stewart reports.

    In fact, long before Eric Rudolph was charged with that crime and a string of other explosions, investigators tell CBS News they now suspect he was little more than a smalltime drug dealer.

    Eric Rudolph, they say, grew some of the most potent marijuana ever found in the Southeast. And from plots near his home in North Carolina, agents say, he trucked it to a drug wholesaler in Nashville, Tenn., where he was paid in cash.

    It was part of the same cash, agents now suspect, he later gave a Tennessee gun dealer for the powder used to blow up Olympic Park.

    And there are two more dots connecting back to Rudolph’s suspected drug past. The reason he was booted out of the Army early, sources say, is because he tested positive for marijuana.

    The reason he’s so successfully disappeared into the North Carolina mountains near his home may be because long before he took up bombing, he prepared a cave from which to watch over his marijuana field – and he’s still hiding in the mountains.
    ……” etc.

    Sounds to me like another terrorist just like the Jihadists, a doper, a bomb maker and a terrorist, but for different reasons. All else the same.

  38. And another mass murderer, from, “George Pierre Hennard was a mass murderer who killed 23 people and wounded dozens of others in a deadly massacre at Luby’s Cafeteria. It was the third-deadliest massacre perpetrated by a single gunman in U.S. history, behind the 2007 Virginia Tech massacre and the 2012 Sandy Hook Elementary School massacre.”

    Excerpts quote: “After graduating high school in 1974, Hennard joined the Navy, where he experienced many troubles, among them an arrest for marijuana possession and a suspension after having a racial argument with a shipmate. He soon went to a substance-abuse program in Houston after being suspended again for marijuana possession aboard a cargo ship, and then drifted from job to job, having numerous jobs in different U.S. states. ,,,,” etc.

  39. Another, this time a former NFL player:

    Aaron Hernandez: Quote (excerpts): “ALL RIVER – A Hartford man who is suing Aaron Hernandez for allegedly shooting him between the eyes testified Wednesday that he used to sell Hernandez as much as four ounces of marijuana at a time, ……

    Alexander Bradley said he met Hernandez in 2011, ,,,,,,Bradley testified that he sold marijuana to Hernandez several times a week, and he usually provided between one and four ounces.

    The pair would smoke together and play video games after the drug deals at Hernandez’s home ……. Bradley said Hernandez “chain smoked.” …….. ,,,, ,,,,,,,,,,,

    In February 2013, Hernandez allegedly shot Bradley in the face after an argument at a Florida strip club and left him lying on the ground. Bradley lost an eye and filed a lawsuit over the attack.

    Odin Lloyd was murdered in North Attleboro four months later. Hernandez and two others are charged with shooting him to death……”

  40. And here’s another murder that has connections, somehow, some way to marijuana, in today’s news. So predictable, and the fact that he had been arrested before for marijuana indicates that marijuana must have been a major part of his life, since most people are NOT being cited for marijuana possession:

    “FBI Special Agent in Charge Terry Wade.Wade added that Begaye was likely alone during the abduction and that agents were unsure if he was related to Ashlynne during the press conference.
    Begaye was cited in Farmington in mid-April for marijuana and paraphernalia possession.

    Read more:

    Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook”

    Coincidence again?

  41. Here’s an excerpt regarding Mark David Chapman who assassinated John Lennon. What an irony that Lennon was a marijuana activist, and that the marijuana and other drugs Chapman abused may have induced his mental deranged that eventually resulted in the murder:

    Quote: Outwardly, the family were viewed as a happy one, and Chapman appeared a normal, well-adjusted boy, with a passion for The Beatles, and John Lennon in particular.

    Until his early teens, that is, when Chapman discovered marijuana, graduating to heroin and LSD, and gravitating towards a drug-dominated social set, which fit well with his counter-culture taste in music. Then, just as suddenly, his rebellious phase ended. At 16 he became an evangelical Christian, and his temperament changed just as abruptly. He acquired a born-again Christian girlfriend, Jessica Blankenship, and a job as a counsellor at a YMCA summer camp, where he was very popular with his young charges.

    Chapman’s hero-worship of Lennon persisted, until Lennon was quoted in the press as saying “We’re more popular than Jesus Christ now,” at which point he renounced his one-time hero…….”

  42. Just moments ago I was started a search for a murder spree at one of the northern California Indian reservations that occurred a couple of years ago. Well, I go the wrong one, and found this instead:

    Quote: “.A tribe is rocked by a shooting rampage that leaves five people dead, including the suspected killer, a former custodian at the reservation casino who was in the midst of a custody dispute
    , Celaya, who was reportedly making about $945 a month, was looking at a year in jail after he was arrested by the Porterville police for drunk driving and being under the influence of drugs in October, the Bee reported.,,,,,,,,,,,”

  43. Moderator: If you don’t mind, here’s a revision of the above with corrections:

    Just moments ago I started a search for a murder spree at one of the northern California Indian reservations that occurred a couple of years ago. Well, I got the wrong one, and found this instead:

    Quote: “A tribe is rocked by a shooting rampage that leaves five people dead, including the suspected killer, a former custodian at the reservation casino who was in the midst of a custody dispute
    , …..Celaya, who was reportedly making about $945 a month, was looking at a year in jail after he was arrested by the Porterville police for drunk driving and being under the influence of drugs in October, the Bee reported.,,,,,,,,,,,”
    Once again, a connection to drugs! Which invariably implies at least use of marijuana. Could this person simply have been attracted to drugs, or did his drug abuse warp his mindset that eventually led to the mass murder? Why on earth is our society not at least wondering, worried and apprehensive to the very distinct possibility (likelihood in my opinion) that mind-altering drugs are actually adversely altering the minds of these sociopaths? Is our nation THAT beholden to marijuana?

    1. When we talk about drugs, let’s make sure it’s marijuana and lets look for evidence that marijuana in and of itself can do it.

  44. And another in recent headline news, Eddie Ray Routh, who allegedly killed Christopher Scott “Chris” Kyle, the author of “American Sniper” and highly decorated hero of US Special Operations.

    Quotes: “Green Oaks had the benefit of examining Routh without preconceptions. The VA did not. A spokesman for the hospital says the knife episode was triggered by a “recent binge on alcohol and marijuana and being off his psychiatric medications”—issues the VA had previously blamed for Routh’s psychotic behavior….”

    And from another source: Nash said that on the morning before the shooting, Routh drank whiskey and smoked marijuana – including “wet,” which often refers to a marijuana joint dipped in formaldehyde…”

    There’s already an established link between marijuana abuse and psychosis. If Routh is using marijuana then, then all odds are he has a history of past marijuana abuse, not just a single episode. The handwriting is on the walls. So much of this madness is connected to the adverse cumulative affects of drug abuse on the brain, yet usually we are lucky to even find out if these sociopaths are using drugs at all, as though it’s considered a non-issue. Imagine what formaldehyde does to the brain too!

    Prior drug abuse should necessarily be any investigation’s primary focus whenever this sort of thing happens. What exactly is our country missing?

  45. Marijuana use in the teenage years is particularly hazardous as the science based article explains:

    Quote: Although the consequences of marijuana use to a person’s health has been debated, an article by the USA Today looks to new studies that suggest that such use can be detrimental to a young, developing brain. These studies suggest that using marijuana during a person’s teenage years may lead to long-term defects in the development of a person’s frontal cortex, one of the last parts of the brain that does not fully mature until the teenager reaches his or her mid-20s. Robert Sapolsky furthers this argument by explaining that damage to this area in earlier ages can lead to the impairment of one’s executive function and a proclivity to choose the “easier” task, a sign of impulsivity. This may manifest itself in criminal activity and violence as a result. Furthermore, similar studies have shown that the use of other illicit drugs early in one’s life has been shown to affect one’s own reward system, can lead to prolonged addiction, and ultimately affect one’s decision making. With all this new information in mind, we need to address how this pertains to the criminal justice system and how this new knowledge can be incorporated.

    Although many critics would claim that neuroscience would allow many more criminals to be less culpable or blameworthy for their crimes, these findings show that the actions and activities one does early in his or her life may have a drastic effect on the brain. It is safe to assume that pre-frontal cortex (PFC) damage arising from marijuana use would be more blameworthy on the person when compared to a medical condition such as epilepsy or schizophrenia…….”


    Personally I suspect this detrimental process of drug abuse in the teenage years, if not earlier, adversely affects the minds of the violent drug cartel members (known to be habitual users), most of our violent, domestic street criminals, and much of the radical Jihadist groups in the Middle East, where hashish runs rampant in certain circles.

    It’s a “no-brainer” what we’re seeing, yet still most of our society is either clueless, or otherwise completely beholden to the “wonders” of their favorite mind-altering drug, marijuana.

  46. Today’s news mentions another murder case in Arkansas (where I believe there are ongoing measures to legalize marijuana) by several teenagers using marijuana: Quotes from various news sources:

    “..Police found two knives, drug paraphernalia and a small amount of marijuana. …”

    “..affidavits filed Thursday describe how the teens said in interviews that Drexler took the weapons used in the shooting from his dad’s collection and that Atchley was involved because of his “vast knowledge of marijuana (buying, selling and growing).” Atchley told Roberts about the plan to kill the Cogdells after he was released from detention…”

    “…In January, Robert Cogdell and Staton had fought after finding marijuana in the boy’s room…”

    All teenagers! This is getting sick, and NOBODY of national presence is at least noticing this and not at least WONDERING? We don’t have to proclaim there’s a causal connection, yet as we STILL don’t have thorough scientific evidence (as though it’s necessary for decision making), but why is there no serious concern about the possibilities?

    Cannabis is known to affect mood and behavior, lower inhibitions, to disrupt vast arrays of neural circuitry in the brain, especially among the youth whose brains are still under development, the association with marijuana and violence is well documented in the science literature, the correlation seems extremely strong, astonishing actually, yet for some reason our national media, academia, our politicians or anyone in high places can’t seem to grasp what’s going on?

    With greater widespread acceptance of marijuana, we might just be creating tens of thousands, maybe hundreds of thousands of sociopaths in the future, and who knows how many of those deranged individuals will be homicidal. Yet we seem just content taking this HUGE gamble. Is that to be our future, a future we want?

  47. Regarding causation, perhaps one important clue is how the Hamas operates using child suicide bombers against Israel. I beckon the reader to search this, whereupon one would find that hashish is the ‘instrument’ given to the children in conjunction with radical propaganda to encourage them to blow themselves up with bombs in public places. The ostensible reason for this, I imagine, is to make Western society feel that that even the Palestinian children are so distraught from “Israeli oppression”, they will even blow themselves up in protest. I suppose many here believe this.
    The reality is that these teenagers, or even children as young as ten years old, are being kidnapped from schools. The children are already under constant bombardment from radical, anti-Israel propaganda. Those chosen are often socially marginalized, or have some ‘issue’ that makes them appear to be suitable candidates. The parents and the rest of their families are threatened to the degree that if they were to protest, to whom anyway?, they also would suffer severe consequences, as one can be assured that Hamas and the other radical groups are well-versed in the art of torture and murder.
    So these kids are further propagandized and convinced they would become admired heroes for committing suicide bombings. The kicker is, to get that mental state to die for such a cause, is coordinated with the influence of hashish. They are not in their right minds, but instead their minds are altered with CANNABIS, probably just like ALL the other suicide bombings, children or not. The children are not really the ‘guilty party’, but instead they are victims of a wicked process to make them look guilty and dupe the West so that we become more and more so anti-Israel. Which all appears to be happening in today’s political climate.
    So these children are not sociopaths who are drawn to cannabis. Instead, they would likely be mostly ‘normal’ kids not inclined to kill. But given hashish and propaganda, they do become suicide bombers.
    The point is, here is a case where individuals with ‘normal’ healthy minds, relatively, are given cannabis to transform themselves into killers.
    I do think this is a valuable clue for our understanding to answer the question at hand, causation or just correlation? Looks to me like causation, or at least a form of ‘enablement’.

  48. I’m sure this is mentioned elsewhere on this website, but just in case it’s worth emphasizing the fact that the notorious murder on the pier in San Francisco this last year by Juan Francisco Lopez-Sanchez ALSO has a connection to marijuana. In fact, the perpetrator was to be deported, but instead called to San Francisco to face MARIJUANA charges.
    This case has so many ironies, so many aspects and facets intricately related to many, many issues of the day. The fact that the man is mentally ill, that he deals and uses drugs, that he uses marijuana, that marijuana is scientifically linked to schizophrenia and so forth, yet the national narrative is about gun control and illegal immigration. But the man was here just like millions of other undocumented aliens to perform a trade, just his trade was dealing drugs. And we allow this, no problem, as our whole country mostly looks the other way. It’s so ironic that San Francisco is exceptionally liberal and open-minded, so anti-gun, etc, etc, yet this particular gun was swiped from law enforcement. Somehow, someway the criminal element always manages to find the guns.
    The real story of course is marijuana abuse and mental illness. Why no one of national presence is picking up on this is mind- boggling. Even if one does not subscribe to the notion of marijuana induced mental illness that can lead to violence, or exacerbation of underlying mental illnesses, shouldn’t any rational mind at least wonder, discuss and explore the possibility?

  49. Interesting article from Carson City:

    “Sheriff: Crimes over marijuana are leading causes of murders in Carson City area”

    Quote from article: “In the last 13-15 years, all of the violence we’ve seen that has turned deadly, have been in someway related to a marijuana issue.”

    In early 2016, 18-year-old Grant Watkins was shot and killed over just three ounces of marijuana in a drug deal. A month later, 40-year-old Dennis Wright Junior was also killed in marijuana deal, this time in nearby South Lake Tahoe.

    “During a transaction, they set it up, ‘I’m going to sell this to you,’ then all of a sudden someone gets shot and killed,” said Sheriff Furlong. “It’s not because they were under the influence; it’s because they were doing something deadly and it turned out that way.” “

  50. San Francisco let him go on his drug crimes………….They were supposed to charge him:..”

    Good point, and a major factor in the whole story. That is, the “Awe heck, it’s just marijuana” mindset applies. Plus the Press, the Atty General, etc, are all downplaying marijuana, stressing how Draconian our marijuana laws are, and so forth. And of course, SF is about as liberal a place as anywhere in the world, so it makes a lot of sense just to let him go. What harm can a little marijuana do anyway? (sarcasm alert)

  51. Marijuana related murders on rise in Colorado:

    Was pot legalization supposed to ‘mellow out’ the would-be murderers? What on earth happened? (more sarcasm alert)

    Several years ago, I noticed a homicide about a mile from me. The young man was killed in a small scale marijuana deal. How can this be? I mean, people interact and often cheat or steal, shoplift, con, overcharge, etc, but they are not murdering each other, unless there is a connection to marijuana.

  52. Hi there. Just wanted to add Eric Klebold and Harris of Columbine fame to your list. They had not only smoked pot the morning g of the masacres, they planned the school shootings to fall on 4/20, or “pot day”.

  53. Looking into Colorado 2015 homicides a bit to see what connections there are to marijuana abuse, I find another mass shooting (defined by 3 or more homicides) in addition to the case of Robert Dear (already a well-documented pot abuser).

    It happened in Colorado Springs, on October 31, 2015 by Noah Harpham who randomly killed three people.

    Quote: “Also in 2013, Kopp blogged about Harpham’s recovery from alcohol and drug abuse and said that her father suffered from drug addiction and mental illness..”

    Here we go again- mental illness and drug abuse. Of all the topics today, this combination should be of top national interest. “Drug abuse” invariably implies marijuana abuse at the very least, while likely other drugs such as perhaps cocaine, or meth were abused too. For the drug user, marijuana is like the ‘base’ drug, the supposedly harmless substance used in the interim between bouts of the “hard stuff”. The problem is, as I see it in my humble opinion, is it is true that the “harder drugs” have adverse effects on the mind, marijuana is what infiltrates the regions of the brain that where behavior is regulated. Disrupting that area lowers the inhibitory threshold while negatively affecting the brain’s natural empathy for human life, imo.

    Now honestly I do not see a reference to any abuse of marijuana by Harpham, though we do know he abused drugs. But nobody as far as I can tell is digging deeper into this and investigating thoroughly. Think about it; Colorado just legalized marijuana, so one would think that it would be a top priority to analyze each and every homicide to see if marijuana was abused in the perpetrator’s past. Do drug tests for sure, but all search property and reveal any findings connected to marijuana, ie the substance or the paraphernalia, or perhaps medical prescriptions, arrest records, whatever, even talk to friends, acquaintances, neighbors, current and past, to understand this completely.

    But we are not doing this.

    We simply can not assume marijuana is harmless because millions of pot lovers say so. That group ( including myriads who are truly, physically addicted (whether they will admit it or not) is essentially dictating the future of American drug policy.

    1. In fact there were articles at the time about Noah Harpham’s marijuana abuse. We do not have that at our fingertips but do in fact know that marijuana was involved. Actually it was just a short period of time before Robert Dear’s shootings.

  54. Though no specific reference was made to marijuana, this article is nonetheless very interesting regarding how drugs can warp and influence the minds of evil people. It’s pertinent because it seems most of society does not seem to grasp this very fundamental concept. Once it is more generally understood and acknowledged, concerns are aroused as part our national dialogue, then we can hone in on which particular drugs might be eliciting the madness, and whether or not mind alterations toward evil can be brought about by marijuana also. The correlation is certainly there!

  55. If anybody comes across any substance abuse history with this latest mass shooter in Orlando, please post info and links.

    I see nothing other than occasional drinking, so maybe the perpetrator’s past regarding mind altering substances is squeaky clean. No arrests, no anecdotes and certainly no reporter anywhere is mentioning a past involving marijuana and other drugs.

    Then again, I’ve seen a couple of live interviews with folks who knew the perpetrator and those particular reporters are not asking the pertinent questions that might indicate whether or not mind altering substances were witnessed to ever have been used.

    But why is that? Professionalism in journalism implies gathering facts. Maybe marijuana acceptance is so commonplace now (in a growing number of circles) that it is regarded as purely harmless, like say coffee use or whatever. Like it’s not even worthwhile investigating. If I were a reporter interviewing the perpetrator’s current and former wife, or his acquaintances, the primary bit of information I would be seeking would be a question of this sort: “Could you tell me from your experience with this individual if you observed or heard of any substance use. Did he drink, did he smoke pot or hashish, eat it or whatever, or did he do any other drugs?”

    The perpetrator is said to have admired the Boston Marathon bombers, who happened to be immersed in marijuana, while many, many other acts of terrorism by individuals of Middle Eastern descent used marijuana also. We need to know if this incident fits the pattern or not. It’s simple information to seek, it’s extremely pertinent and it could yield a clue to why all this senseless murder occurs.

    Yes or no is all we ask, but for whatever reason, either by ignorance or duplicity, we are not getting this valuable information.

  56. Oh, and let me say an important observation I have made lately. For instance I asked a couple of homeless individuals whether or not they used drugs. Both said they did not use drugs, but they did drink and they did smoke marijuana.

    So for some folks anyway, marijuana is not even considered a drug, which I think is important to understand when seeking information. So, there may be a claim that the Orlando shooter did not use drugs (the vernacular for cocaine, heroin and the other ‘hard stuff”, but that assertion will not necessarily rule out the use of marijuana.

  57. A bit of research shows that the Orlando shooter’s high school (he attended Martin Co. High School at least for his freshman year) was reported in prior years to have relatively high rates of substance abuse among students:

    “According to the survey, 55.9 percent of Martin County’s high school students have tried marijuana compared to 49.1 percent in St. Lucie and 36.6 percent statewide. Local use of other substances, from inhalants to designer drugs, is also rising, and is already above the state average. ”


    Interpreting this loosely, it’s fair to estimate the shooter statistically from that one source alone had at least a 50/50 chance of having used marijuana as a teenager.

  58. For the record, here’s another correlation of pot using Americans joining terrorist groups:
    “Mug shot from 6/04/2003 Arrest in Anoka County, Minnesota. Charges: Possession of Marijuana and Driving with a Suspended License. Douglas McCain was killed last weekend in Syria, where he was fighting for ISIS, two U.S. officials told CNN. Courtesy: CNN”
    Once again, interesting correlations. Could McCain have been more susceptible because he used marijuana, or is it simply his type of personality is attracted to marijuana?

  59. Often we hear how in the process of these horrific crimes witnesses point out how the perpetrator actually laughed, as appears to the case in this recent, horrific Orlando shooting.

    ‘He laughed as he shot us’, according to a survivor.

    This could be because the neurotransmitter dopamine becomes activated in the commission of the crime, since a sudden sense of euphoria is known to induce laughter.

    If so, then the process may also be an end result of prior marijuana abuse from even months or years before. Researchers have found that while under the influence of marijuana, subjects can make concurrent associations with environmental input. That is, perhaps while under the influence of marijuana, as thoughts of the moment are amplified while intoxicated, anger and resentment about anything such as ideology becomes inculcated into the mind via association. Researchers then found (this is in the scientific literature) that at later dates, even without the presence of marijuana, the former association can also trigger release of dopamine into the brain!

    So while using marijuana, the brain becomes conditioned and loses its own natural ability to maintain a normal balance of dopamine. The drug has usurped this role. With tolerance, the brain seeks more and more drug in increasingly vain attempts to regain normalcy. But for some, perhaps at the core of the ‘radicalization’ process, the mind can also gain back dopamine levels by carrying out violent deeds learned while formerly under the influence.

    This new rush of dopamine might explain the sadistic laughter, and might also explain in part why many of these sociopaths in the immediate aftermath of the crime will not test positive for marijuana. Commission of the crime itself substituted for the marijuana high. Thoughts?

  60. Break through! Just found a reference to Omar Mateen admitting to having used marijuana!

    From abc news article:

    Quote: “On the questionnaire, Mateen said that in 2006, he was on a “ridealong” with a police deputy in St. Lucie when the patrol car hydroplaned and “got wrapped around a tree.”

    In a portion of the questionnaire dealing with drug usage, Mateen answered “yes” to having used cannabis or marijuana and steroids. He wrote that he did not drink alcohol, the documents say.

    Mateen checked “yes” to a question that asked if he had “ever been arrested, charged or received a notice or summons to appear, convicted, pled nolo contendere or pled guilty for any criminal violation or detained by ANY law enforcement agency.” There was no further explanation on the form.

    Mateen also checked “yes” to a question asking if he had ever committed or been involved in an undetected crime of any type, such as drinking, petit theft, shoplifting or stealing from an employer. Again, there was no further explanation.

    Mateen said he had some sort of criminal record sealed or expunged, but no explanation was provided as to what the record was….”


    Wow! Though this is not ‘smoking gun’ by any means, we do now have at least the correlation. Incredible!

  61. And another interesting tidbit from Mateen’s childhood. Of course this incident can mean anything, but it does show some kind of ‘joy’ or amusement or attention given to marijuana that may possibly be an early indication:

    Quote: “”He attended Manatee Elementary School in first and second grade, then transferred to Mariposa Elementary School, where he finished second grade and stayed through fifth grade, according to documents.

    As early as third grade, Mateen was verbally abusive, rude and aggressive, according to the documents obtained by Treasure Coast Newspapers. He talked frequently of violence and obscenities, documents revealed.

    “”Once, in third grade, instead of singing “Mariposa, Mariposa” in the school song, Mateen sang “Marijuana, marijuana,” according to records”……….”

    This connection between senseless murder and an affinity for marijuana among a great many homicidal sociopaths keeps coming up over and over again.

  62. Expanding upon the above hypothesis, and applying this now to Omar Mateen, the latest mass shooter who used drugs:

    So imagine a teenager engaging in drugs, mostly marijuana, whose mind is not fully developed, and how this supposedly ‘innocuous’ indulgence may interfere with the brain’s normal development during childhood. THC and many of the other psychoactive components of cannabis are scientifically shown to infiltrate and modify the very key areas of the brain that harbor mood, basic behavior, feelings, restraint (or inhibitions), rational reasoning, etc. This interruption of the young adult’s neural development necessarily implies the distinct possibility that his or her ability to restrain impulses (from I believe the amygdala) via rational thought may never fully mature. Genetic and environmental circumstances dictate the individuals susceptibility. The adult is thus more likely to act upon impulse, which implies the propensity for violent behavior is not restrained as it should be.

    Also understand how drugs overwhelm the senses, interfere with the ‘quartet’ of neurotransmitters of the endocannabinoid system (the pleasure/reward basic function of the brain) and induce a dopamine rush to the user, or the ‘high’.

    That new source of pleasure is a tremendous magnification, perhaps ten to fifteen fold beyond the brain’s natural ability to affect feelings of well-being. With continued abuse, the brain’s natural ability is lessened (ie the natural neural sensitivity is downregulated, just like continued loud noises reduce our ability to hear), and the brain learns to admire, appreciate and further desire the external drug that brings this about.

    Eventually the individual feels pretty ‘down’ because the brain has lost its natural abilities to make the person feel good. At this point, some degree of the addictive process is in effect. The individual’s mind directs him to seek recourse in order to simply feel good, or normal. Initially the highs really are feeling good, but eventually the individual natural well-being gets so low that more and more drug use is needed just in vain attempts to feel normal! It’s a vicious downward spiral. A trap that if not well understood by an educated public is certain to doom many unfortunate individuals who are innocently lured into the world of drugs for a variety of reasons.

    With marijuana, it’s also scientifically shown from lab research studies show that users under the influence are conscious enough to comprehend whatever thoughts or discussions are in their immediate environment. And I think the abuser of marijuana experiences a magnified intensity of the moment. What’s most astonishing and critical for our understanding is that those thoughts or experiences of the moment while high, can also at some future date stimulate dopamine releases EVEN WITHOUT THE PRESENCE OF MARIJUANA! This is key.

    Whether those individuals are truly addicted, or merely suffer from some kind of Marijuana Abuse Disorder, as it’s now called, a lifetime habit has formed. With the downward progression of repeated abuse, as the mind feels more and more down, prompting the individual to seek more drug just to try to feel normal, it’s very possible some of those individuals may also seek the associations they made while being high before.

    So imagine the environment of Mateen in his earlier years (or simply pick your terrorist who used marijuana- the 911 clan, Brussels, Paris twice, Abduleeza, Loughner, Holmes, Dear, Roof, and a cazillion others) where there already is an environment of strife, anger and radical thoughts. Mateen, as well as much of the Arab culture, is immersed in an environment of antipathy towards the West, Israel, the US involvement in the Middle East, etc. Many Middle Easterners, many of whom seem naturally ‘hot-headed’ (but by no means, all, please understand), continually bombard themselves with thoughts of resentment and anger, frustration, disappointment etc.

    So Mateen grows up in this environment. Naturally he and his family, although naturalized Americans, do harbor common feelings with their Afghan ancestry, and understandably so. (Apply this to European terrorists also.) As Mateen engages in drugs, not only does his brain fail to fully mature to a rational, sentient adult with natural restraint and inhibition to control unreasonable impulses, he also has inculcated into his neural network while under the influence of marijuana in years past, this association with the highs of marijuana. That is those thoughts even without marijuana can offer the mind relief and solace, within the progression of his ‘marijuana abuse disorder’.

    That is, somewhere along this progression of getting high, getting down and all the subsequent periods in vain attempts just to feel normal, Mateen (or pick your terrorist) resorts to a violent act. At that point, they are so down, so distraught, so hopelessly trapped with their drug habits, they have no sense for the meaning of life. It’s like an extreme act of violence is their last resort to regain some kind of dopamine high!

    Of course, this is ALL hypothesis, yet follow me through and I think it does make sense.

    Now, another key potential validation of this angle is how these murderous sociopaths are often witnessed to be laughing while killing. That could be the dopamine rush. Users of marijuana are known to break out laughing or giggling because they can not help it during the euphoria induced from the dopamine rush from the drug.

    Now in the case of Mateen, or many of the others, this last ditch effort of the brain to gain back what was lost from years of past abuse, during the progression of that downward spiral, the extreme violent act (learned from association before while high from marijuana), is the last best hope to regain healthy dopamine levels. The vicious crime is motivated by a deranged sense of revenge, and as the perpetrator kills, he does get his dopamine that had been so sorely lacking. The dopamine ‘rush’ from killing, just like marijuana had done before, is the equivalent of using the drug, and because of it, he is laughing uncontrollably.

  63. Just one typo in the above, I think (not bad 🙂 ):

    “As Mateen engages in drugs, not only does his brain fully mature to a rational, sentient adult with natural restraint and inhibition to control unreasonable impulses, he also has inculcated into his neural network while under the influence of marijuana in years past, this association with the highs of marijuana..”

    Should be “As Mateen engages in drugs, not only does his brain fail to fully mature to a rational, sentient adult with natural restraint and inhibition to control unreasonable impulses, he also has inculcated into his neural network while under the influence of marijuana in years past, this association with the highs of marijuana..”

  64. Here’s a typical story that happens over and over again all over the country. The same question arises, while the same worn out conclusion continues that the reason must be the presence of guns:

    From AP: “Officer critical but stable; convicted felon arrested”

    PHILADELPHIA (AP) — A police officer was shot several times Friday as he approached people suspected of smoking marijuana behind an apartment building, prompting a three-hour manhunt near Philadelphia that halted a dozen Amtrak trains, authorities said.

    Folcroft Officer Christopher Dorman, 25, sustained injuries that required at least two surgeries, officials said. He was in critical but stable condition Friday, and police had a suspect in custody.

    Police chief Robert Ruskowski wondered aloud at a news conference how somebody “just hanging out, smoking grass at 10 o’clock in the morning … is willing to take your life.”

    Donte Island had served about nine years in federal prison on a gun conviction before his release in 2013. His parole officer requested an arrest warrant and revocation hearing in September after Island repeatedly tested positive for marijuana, which he said he used for stress, court records show. But the officer then had trouble finding Island at his listed Folcroft address, and there’s no sign the hearing occurred…. ”


    To answer the perpetual question of why this happens, that is someone abusing marijuana turns out not to be mellow as is commonly accepted, but instead homicidal, how about marijuana induced mental illness, or some kind of mental disorder from abuse?

    Whether or not one agrees with the premise, why is this concept so hard to grasp, and why aren’t folks at high levels at least wondering about this?

  65. Regarding this dopamine high from killing, as I hypothisize.

    Imagine an individual who regularly abuses drugs, specifically marijuana, who with repeated abuse, endures the highs and lows cycle typical of a drug habit as tolerance increases. The brain’s natural ability to produce the proper balance of neurotransmitters that make people feel good and happy is gradually being destroyed, and supplanted with the perpetual need for more drug just to get the dopamine to feel normal.

    Simultaneously, the individual while intoxicated from marijuana, and while experiencing the dopamine euphoria, can also make associations with whatever input there is at the moment. Those associations are also received positively by the brain while intoxicated. They can be music, or relationships, or just about anything at the time. So some abusers or marijuana begin to truly believe cannabis is a panacea, their ultimate medicine. The neurons re-adjust and those beliefs become hardwired into the individual’s mind.

    Or in the case of strife, anger, radical thoughts, stressful situations, or ideological indoctrination (such as jihad radicalization), the user of marijuana incorporates those thoughts while high into the neural networks. The thoughts to release that anger and seek a perverted sense of justice through violent acts becomes inculcated into the brain.

    So along the downward progression of marijuana abuse during the cycles of lows and highs, as the brain seeks desparately for more drug just to get the dopamine to feel normal, or vain attempts thereof, there can be a last ditch effort of drastic measure to regain dopamine. It’s compulsion, an uncontrollable drive.

    And I think at this point, the individual prone to violent acts, as part of mental desperation from the wicked up and down cycles of drug abuse, with increasing downs and the drive for the brain to have dopamine, really does decide to commit acts of horror.

  66. I was just thinking this morning and wondering why mainstream America can not seem to grasp, let alone accept this simple concept that drug induced mental illness may be the big contributor to senseless violence.

    Well, of course, everybody knows that alcohol for instance, can derange minds and drastically alter an abuser’s behavior well beyond the point of intoxication. For the alcoholic (ie addicted) it’s the vicious cycle of intoxication followed by withdrawal that can lead to mental disturbances, life altering changes in behavior, and eventually in some dire cases, suicide.

    The chemical imbalances in the brain of the alcoholic are driving the abuser’s behavior beyond his or her control. It’s basic, rudimentary understanding that everybody accepts today. It is in essence a disease of the brain of some sorts, whether or not the word ‘disease’ is the best choice, but you get the idea.

    Now, in our relatively new era of drug experimentation, that is from about 50 years ago as the rock music industry really helped popularize drugs into the mainstream, (Bob Dylan introduced the Beatles to marijuana in 1964 for instance) it might be harder to grasp what is happening to the mind of abusers. But the same principles apply.

    Except in the case of drug abuse, specifically marijuana, the changes and alterations of the mind are very tricky and difficult to grasp. Even the scientific community does not have a clear understanding of what’s happening. But SOMETHING is happening and it is not good.

    Yet it should be readily apparent to just about anybody that like the affects of alcohol, introducing strange chemicals into the brain, this delicate, complex network of neurons, can really alter abuser behavior. So alcoholics are beset with all sorts of problems, whereas illicit drug abusers, including marijuana are also beset with a whole host of problems albeit with different outcomes.

    Some with drug addictions do commit suicide, for instance. It’s an accepted fact, and the obvious reason is the drug itself altered the mind very adversely! Simple logic. The biological reason is of course the disruption of the pleasure/reward system of neurotransmitters, sinking the abuser to an extremely low and hopeless point of desperation, he or she feels the only escape is suicide.

    Now why is it so hard to understand simply the possibility that some drug abusers, specifically marijuana abusers, whose minds are susceptible to adverse affects of addiction or abuse disorders, and whose minds are also subjected to radicalism, stress and strife and vengeful indoctrination, that those thoughts might be incorporated directly into their substance abuse disorder?

    At some point of their mental lows from the up and down cycles of drug (marijuana in the case of Mateen) abuse, those points of desperation, instead of simply committing suicide, their brains are compelled out of learned vengeance (because of neurotransmitter imbalance) to kill a lot of other people too, not just themselves?

    Like I said earlier, it may be these acts of horror are based on the compelling drive of the brain to seek solace via vengeance (formerly inculcated into the brain’s neural hardwiring), which in turn briefly triggers a surge of desperately needed dopamine, or some combination or neurotransmitters the brain has sorely been deprived of.

  67. Regarding the most recent terrorist attack, this time in Nice, France, perpetrated by a man named Mohamed Lahouaiej Bouhlel, even without much information in advance, it was almost predictable that there was a history of cannabis abuse:

    From quote: “Bouhlel, 31, a kickboxer and gym fanatic, is believed to have been taking strong medication to control mood swings which had ruined his marriage.

    He is also said to be have been addicted to strong cannabis which made his bouts of mental illness more alarming. …”

    Interesting too, and seemingly another predictable trait sometimes, is Bouhlel apparently laughed during the process: (from quote: “We started seeing people getting trampled and he was swerving the truck around. As he was doing that, people were flying 15ft in the air like cannon balls. All you could hear was shouting and screaming. Mothers pushing their kids with their strollers and him laughing like a maniac.”

    This laughter could be a natural response to dopamine release (or a combination of neurotransmitters) while committing the crimes. That is, at some point during his marijuana use disorder, or addiction, with the typical progression of highs and lows of withdrawal, rather than seeking another drug, or more potent marijuana, as is often the case, he was a such a point of despondency, carrying act this learned act of terror (from association while previously intoxicated months or years prior) brought temporary relief to his deranged mind.

  68. Here’s a case of marijuana and other drugs found among Neo-Nazi groups in New York. This seems to have been a prevented disaster, so obviously not as news worthy. I think it’s also important to know since often there’s this misconception that the neo-Nazis, skinheads or whatever, are simply ultra “right wing” groups that one would think are not engaging in drug abuse. But here it is for the record:

    From the Daily Beast June 18, 2016, quote: “At a press conference, police shared disturbing photographs taken from inside the neo-Nazi lair.
    The brothers allegedly had their hands on a .40-caliber Glock, six assault rifles, four rifles, 25 high-capacity magazines, a shotgun and stun gun. Cops also found marijuana and hallucinogenic mushrooms, 14 knives, more than 3,000 rounds of ammunition, and $42,940 in cash.
    Investigators also discovered a racist manifesto inside a leather-bound binder, along with other Nazi propaganda, CBS reported.“Today’s search warrant might have prevented a deadly, violent incident like we recently saw in Orlando,” said Tim Sini, commissioner of the Suffolk County Police Department.
    “To think that this,” Sini added, while gesturing to a photo of Perkowski loot that included a swastika flag and framed portrait of Hitler, “was in the town of Brookhaven was extremely disturbing”
    Friends and family of the Perkowski brothers did not return multiple messages left by The Daily Beast. ….” and more.

    One must then wonder how widespread is marijuana abuse among these extremist groups, and to what degree there may be mental derangement or distorted perceptions because of marijuana that may eventually lead to and enable violent acts.

  69. Regarding the recent shooting and murder of several cops in Dallas, TX by Michael Xavier Johnson, I do not see any reference to past drug abuse reported in the media. Maybe others have such info?

    Anyway, I would imagine there is likely a virtual certainty that he did use marijuana and other drugs, or perhaps hashish while serving in Afghanistan. Some substantiating facts one way or the other sure would be nice though.

    But there may be one tell-tale feature: From CNN, quote: “Shortly after he gunned down five officers in Dallas, Micah Xavier Johnson sang and laughed at police. He threatened more deaths with …”


    This laughter may be a dopamine rush from killing. It is well established in the literature that the rush of dopamine and other neurotransmitters while intoxicated from marijuana can induce uncontrollable laughter.

    Now, carrying out this act of terror as a result of anger and frustration that had been building up inside him for months or years was perhaps part of the progression of drug abuse. At some point he needed another and stronger kind of ‘high’ to keep his brain functioning. So rather than the natural compulsion to find more potent drugs (the brain demands them and drives the behavior to get them), he got his new ‘drug rush dopamine infused euphoria’ from carrying out an act of revenge. I am blazing new territory with this, and it seems that among this cycle of the ups and downs of drug abuse, there may be a point of despondency or desperation so that there is an equivalence between either using marijuana or killing. And thus the maniacal laughter as is often witnessed.

    Thoughts, anybody?

  70. Regarding the recent knife attack in Berlin:

    Witnesses said the assailant, who was arrested at the scene shortly after the attack, shouted “Allahu Akbar” (‘God is Greatest’ in Arabic) and some said that they also heard him shout “infidels must die”.

    But police said that the assault appeared to be the work of a mentally unstable person, and that the attacker had received psychiatric treatment just two days ago and had confessed to using drugs.

    “From what we know so far, he was a lone criminal … There is no indication that he was part of an Islamist network,” said Petra Sandles, of Bavaria’s office of criminal investigations.

    The attack, even if it turns out not to be Islamist motivated, will heighten fears in Germany that the country is being targeted by extremists….”


    Drugs again! And most certainly implies a history of marijuana abuse as well.

    And another attack in Munich now. No information, but a highly predictable blueprint is as follows: Young male of Middle Eastern descent, very little if any ties to Islam, at least not devout at all, smokes, drinks, uses drugs including marijuana and has a history of mental instability.

  71. Another mass shooting in the last day or two, this on in Austin. Texas. The suspect is Endicott McCray.

    Now, simply search his name plus marijuana, and several arrest records appear. News Quote: “McCray, who records show has several felony burglary convictions, is scheduled to appear in Hays County court in September for a possession of marijuana charge.”

    So predictable and so common. It happens over and over and over again, and no one of national presence or authority is at the very least WONDERING about the correlation, let alone the possibility of MARIJUANA ABUSE DISORDER being a factor?

    Marijuana is known to lower inhibitions, alter mood and behavior, can create habits and addictions, and so forth. Some 300-500 chemicals settle into the brain, so why is this so hard to at least comprehend the possibility that something is happening adversely to brains cells?

  72. Regarding the recent attack by the teenager in Munich, Germany that left 10 dead, here’s some information that tends to lend to the possibility of marijuana abuse: ” In a Saturday, July 23 press conference, Munich police described Sonboly as depressed and deranged, and said he had received psychiatric treatment in the past, AFP said. In a citizen video captured while he was on a rooftop, Sonboly had mentioned being bullied and previously seeking medical treatment. ”

    At least a few tell tale characteristics emerge: young male, angry, slighted (in this case, bullying), feelings of revenge, mental issues and likely prescribed medication.

    On another related topic: One huge problem we face is that this correlation to marijuana (not this case, but in general) is that there will NO serious investigation to see if cannabis had ever been used, and at the same time, society with the increasingly left-leaning media, will be persuaded this crime as many of the others, are either because of the “gun culture” or the perpetrators were extreme right wing folks, and certainly a combination of both when applicable. All the while marijuana becomes more and more accepted, liberalized and legalized, and we all remain clueless.

    The horrid act on 911 inspired two major wars, costs trillions of dollars, hundreds of thousands of lives, disrupted millions of families, caused havoc to the world economy, caused major readjustments for safety all over the world, FOREVER, and did tremendous amounts of damage to our psyche. And the perpetrators are known to have used marijuana.

    The most heinous crimes the world has ever known are being perpetrated by users of marijuana, yet the mantra remains the same, as though more marijuana use will bring out more love and peace.

  73. Same as above, but with corrections! Please use this one, Thanks,

    Regarding the recent attack by the teenager in Munich, Germany that left 10 dead, here’s some information that tends to lend to the possibility of marijuana abuse: ” In a Saturday, July 23 press conference, Munich police described Sonboly as depressed and deranged, and said he had received psychiatric treatment in the past, AFP said. In a citizen video captured while he was on a rooftop, Sonboly had mentioned being bullied and previously seeking medical treatment. ”

    At least a few tell tale characteristics emerge: young male, angry, slighted (in this case, bullying), feelings of revenge, mental issues and likely prescribed medication.

    On another related topic: One huge problem we face is that this correlation with marijuana (not this case, but in general) we see so often is that there may continue to be NO serious investigation to see what effects may be attributed to cannabis, let alone investigation even if cannabis had ever been used. And at the same time aided by the left-leaning media, society will be increasingly persuaded the killing rampages are because of the persistent “gun culture” of which extreme right wing folks are to blame. All the while marijuana becomes more and more accepted, liberalized and legalized, while general society remains clueless.

    The horrid act on 911 inspired two major wars, costs trillions of dollars, hundreds of thousands of lives, disrupted millions of families, caused havoc to the world economy, caused major readjustments for safety all over the world, FOREVER, and did tremendous amounts of damage to our psyche. And the perpetrators are known to have used marijuana.

    The most heinous crimes the world has ever known are being perpetrated by users of marijuana, yet the mantra remains the same, as though more marijuana use will bring out more love and peace.

  74. I will be the first to admit I am wrong at times, and I do come with some wild ideas that do prove invalid. But why not? Isn’t imagination the first step toward exploration and development of new ideas?

    Anyway, I am referring specifically to my thoughts on the laughter that seems to often accompany the perpetrators of heinous crimes. Although I still think the dopamine release angle it’s a neat idea, there is not much scientific substance to this hypothesis at all.

    I am not giving up on it as a possibility, and ultimately it could be proven valid. But please don’t take that idea too seriously. The laughter could also simply be the jubilation those criminals have as the release their pent-up anger and have nothing to do with dopamine release. Count me wrong if need be. I can take it!
    And oh, there is another possible explanation speculated by one of the world’s leading neuroscientists regarding the link between cannabis and schizophrenia. And that suggestion is that many marginally mentally ill individuals might feel something is wrong with themselves, and they may be more inclined to self-medicate with marijuana. So, cannabis might not be the link to schizophrenia, just that those individuals are attracted.

    That too is a potential counterpoint, though the scientists readily point out there is a still a seven fold increase in schizophrenia patients when marijuana is involved. (I am not explaining that perfectly, but you get the idea.)

    The correlation, the connection, the causation and so forth comprise one enormous enigma to modern science. On the one hand it’s should certainly be valid for many of us to wonder and suspect causation (or enablement), while on the other, it’s certainly valid to suggest there is none.

    But unfortunately what we are seeing mostly throughout western civilization is a complete state of denial from marijuana apologists and unscientific, unknowing, self-proclaimed experts who staunchly claim there is no possible medical causation.

    That’s the problem. They can’t possibly ‘know’ that, but they sure vehemently proclaim it. And that is not science either.

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